Undergoing 2 door VIP project Onetongarage style!!

[Herb]

Before i start posting some teaser pictures of my '90 240sx hatch. I would like to thank Van (onetongarage) for having my suspension work and custom fender rolling + pul done! (which i might need a couple more mm's to clear (rear) for the heavy freeway bumps etc etc). Mark (Bboxd) for the nice SSR's. I just aquired this project about 4-5 months ago from my neighbor who didnt need a 2nd car and up until today i am waiting for my aeroparts, get the interior redone with a classier/exec style look, clean sound system on the backhatch* and possibly Air suspension for the car. Before i had the 240 you might recognize me with the scion XA on some work euroline DH's, the project was scraped and a possible re-make sometime in the near future. BTW here's a picture:
http://static.flickr.com/1/131060004_9161881060.jpg

Enough of my background stuff let me post Vans work of art on a 240 with 19x9+6 215/35/19 Fronts and 19x10+0 225/35/19 rear (Falken GRb)
http://static.flickr.com/53/192259832_f877e117d0_b.jpg
http://static.flickr.com/52/192259830_71c5d5ce40_b.jpg
http://static.flickr.com/45/192259827_2abef1c607_b.jpg
http://static.flickr.com/66/192259826_7ae471a6b9_b.jpg

The front has about 2.5 degrees of camber and the rears is approx 4 degrees. (Van Help me out on this LOL)

The whole set-up is still growing to me, like i said on top that it needs a little bit more of clearance on the rears since its still rubbing with bumps + lean. I personally havent seen 19's in person on a s13 nor a VIP styled one either, which i hope i could pull it off from Onetonegarage's quality of work to make a car done right! Ill keep you guys posted on my project!

Herb
Herb.Real@gmail.com

[dome1984]

well this looks quite unusual but i like it :D

[shoez]

Its lookin good! I think when the aero comes in, (what kit are you looking at?) it will balance out the rest of the car. Seeing a stock-body 240SX on 19's may be a bit... different :D

[Gao Jian]

the wheels are looking sick, can't wait to see the areokit you guys cook up for this thing. The build is coming along be sure to keep us posted.

Jake

[Herb]

Thanks for the comments guys! 19's on a stock body does stand out specially when your in the freeway and everyone stares at the wheels mostly ;D. As far as aero goes, Van is making arrangements with the guys from supermade to get my kit in sometime in the next month or so. I like how their slogan goes by "instant Gentleman" and in addition their aero kits are more of a non agressive style (i love the sexy front bumpers that caves down) compared to origin, Bn, etc etc. (the snow plow kits). Im definately going to keep you guys posted with this project. Thanks!!

Herb
Herb.Real@gmail.com

[Gao Jian]

with Van helping you out I have high hopes for this car :smitten: (i love clean 240's)

[bB]

man thats a sweet looking 240. i always wanted one. :o :o :o

[AME_VIP]

umm wow ! Those look massive. Hopefully a kit will make them look a little smaller. Interesting direction.

[jbo]

Im digging it now so after the kit it should look amazing and with Van on your team you should definitely have a winner.

[bBOXD]

Lookin good mah man! I was shocked to see these pics when i got back. You guys went to work while a was away. hahah. Very nice work guys! I cant wait until the kit shows up. This car is gonna be nuts. :) Look out for this one guys. Good job listening Herb! heh.

[shawnthemonster]

looks like a great start... love the wheel choice too ;)

[CharismaY33]

Yea the wheel choice is very good. im happy i like the way this is going keep us posted im anxious to see how this will fold...

[Herb]

thanks Guys!!! i took the car back to Van's and cleared a little bit more MM's on the rear fenders to accomodate the harsh driveways and such. Mark!!!Thanks brotha!! im pretty stunned with just the 19's on and like most of you guys couldnt wait til i get the aero!! Correction: The tires are the Falken FK451's and i just confirmed that the rear is running 7 degrees of camber! lol

Ill keep you folks posted on this project!

Herb
Herb.Real@gmail.com

[jtanoyo1]

Folding of the inner lip on the rear fenders could be a bit tidier. Even from these photos, I could see creases along the line. But I think it's mostly coz the wheels are scraping them on bumps. Pull it out a bit more or shave it completely, but then you will lose structural rigidity....hmmm..

[Projektsol]

damn thats crazy camber

[One Ton VIP]

>HAHAHA< You posted too much, too soon herb! When that happens people don't realize that the car isn't done, and they get overly critical of it in its current unfinished state... which is to be expected.
BTW jon you are right.. there are ripples on the rear left fender lip. Apparently the car had a previous repair from the previous owner, and the body shop did something interesting to the lip (one part of it was segmented/cut and then notched)... I'm assuming it prob had a slight long length dent... the kind you get when you scrape against a wall or pole etc. Again, more detail stuff that should be taken care of when the bodywork is done with the kit going on.
Someone sent me this link and I thought it was sorta hilarious:
http://www.ziptied.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9411
You gotta take most everything everyone said there with a grain of salt (whether it was positive or negative) because, all you gotta do is look at those guys' cars now. And then look back at the shit they were posting less than 2-3 years ago... funny how they now all try to emulate the cars they would decry back then. I'm not saying I anticipate them going with such an extreme-and less sporty-style for their cars in 1-2 years (I honestly hope they don't...assuming they still have their 240s then)... but it's still an interesting observation, and something that an observant person will want to make note of. Heck, I remember so many of those guys on there who just even recently (within 6-8 years) thought they were gods of the honda/acura world and thought rwd nissans were stupid... and look at them now... "gods" of the nissan world. >HAHAHA< It'd be funny to C&P this from HERE to THERE (in reference to the other thread about viplife's old car... where I did mean to have stuff copied from this board, to that board).

[zion_97]

Love the strech on the tires, nice :smitten:

[Herb]

Van

In their interest, they seem like these bandwagoneers dont think outside the box and break something out of the norm. Its expected for my car to get bashed (not worried since everyone has their own taste) since they are the main stream of this Uber-cool forum just for the super intelligent individuals who eats and sleep drifting. My main concern is, these guys are too good to criticize an unfinished car and put their heart out about thier opinions and when you read it, Their composition/judging is just as good as the smartest kid who graduated from the school for the mentally ill.

The snow plow design with super duper wide wheels with mad crazy offset that needs 2 layers of 50MM over fender on each side with the inexpensive spray paint and who doesnt like to pay top quality work on their 240's are the best from what these guys see and this is the reason why in everything as far as cars there's 2 forms of society, One is bandwagoneers and Trendsetters, Period.


Herb

[firelizard]

Yeah, you're right. But that said, while I appreciate what you and Van are doing, the car as it is doesn't look good to me, it does look like a cambered donk style - if ATL did 240SXs.

To borrow edit Van's sig:
"If someone with the same car has a 17" that fits perfectly, why order the same wheel in 19" Welcome to the world of "I went too far."

But I'll reserve my final judgement for when you're done, hard to really imagine what the final product will look like.

[bBOXD]

Build it and they will come. Its all tooo familiar for me... Good job Herb!

[VIPete]

Good job, but show it off when the car is done! Showoff the final product and this will allieviate any flamage action -- especially on Ziptied. HAHA

Btw, excellent job on the fitment!

[Herb]

Thanks guys! As far as the car sits right now, it needs a lot of work. I could barely wait for the aero and the other things to come in. we just have to wait for the final product. :)

Herb

[battleaxe]

Van

In their interest, they seem like these bandwagoneers dont think outside the box and break something out of the norm. Its expected for my car to get bashed (not worried since everyone has their own taste) since they are the main stream of this Uber-cool forum just for the super intelligent individuals who eats and sleep drifting. My main concern is, these guys are too good to criticize an unfinished car and put their heart out about thier opinions and when you read it, Their composition/judging is just as good as the smartest kid who graduated from the school for the mentally ill.

The snow plow design with super duper wide wheels with mad crazy offset that needs 2 layers of 50MM over fender on each side with the inexpensive spray paint and who doesnt like to pay top quality work on their 240's are the best from what these guys see and this is the reason why in everything as far as cars there's 2 forms of society, One is bandwagoneers and Trendsetters, Period.


Herb



Sorry but I'd have to disagree.

A lot of these guys have never owned hondas (or if some did it was never in a tuning sence)
and were more or less apart of the ghetto 240s era when they first started here to get going with drifting.
This was a solid 5yrs ago as well, as this was the time i got my 240 as well when SR's werent mainstream, drifting wasnt mainstream, 240s in general were still used by grannys and older people as a source of transpertation. This was even a time when F&F wasnt apart of our pop culture daily dialogue and not even released and the honda scene was at its peak.

A lot of these guys do have nice paint jobs. We still like our cars to look good even though your more likly going to wreck it eventually
Yes you can spend 4000+ on a paint job and in only the most nit-picky of ways will it 'be worth it'
This is a group who builds fancy cars AFTER they became good drivers, that is a drivers forum, not a styling forum
and if u look back through the years of japanese car culture in drifting, theres different groups of styling, this is of mainly one style with a couple groups having their own styles. in drifting the styles are from very subtle, to the extreme spoilers, kits, wheels etc. You cant group them all as one, without thinking this forum as well is predominently focused one one styling as well, even though there are other VIP styles.

Much like VIP styling, theres many types of styling in the grouping, one of which starts as yankee style and goes to the extreme space ships (mainly fiberglass and wood) and somewhere in between VIP is in there bridging the gap between crazy wheels and gorgeous 'gentlemen" cars. Your VIP styling comes in the form of subtle aero with demon camber, some groups choose this cause they like mega stretch and mega low offsets and want to use large overfenders to fit them (doesnt look like u choose the overfenders).

Im not trying to be critical or anything, as ive seen 19's on a 240 in person and honestly with aero they look like 18s, not as noticeable as with stock aero. Regardless, id just hope that everyone would be more open minded.

I personally am interested to see where u go with this as i havent seen a 240 done in VIP styling before, and seeing OneTon's Q at one time in pics im interested.



The snow plow design with super duper wide wheels with mad crazy offset that needs 2 layers of 50MM over fender on each side with the inexpensive spray paint and who doesnt like to pay top quality work on their 240's are the best from what these guys see and this is the reason why in everything as far as cars there's 2 forms of society, One is bandwagoneers and Trendsetters, Period.

That ^^ is just plain ignorance, mind u its also ignorant of them to not know you or where you come from (car modding etc.)
you yourself have low offset large wheels that uses CAMBER to fit wheels instead of overfenders, thats preference

and btw whats 2 layers of 50mm overfenders?

Damn near that whole board works on their own cars (95%+) and for some custom parts that we cant do, we take to a shop to help with, and im sure 90% of the members on the board, the regulars dont have spray paint on their cars

saying theres only 2 forms of car culture sections is like saying theres only love and fear no middle ground, and that is just plain ridiculous, bandwagoners pick up when things get big... how do u explain japanese car culture? theres iunno how many different styles used on all forms of vehicles, u saying most of them are bandwagoners for modding a car?

wow u put 19s on a 240... theres probably 6 dozen ppl in japan who did that too, maybe ur copying them? would u be a bandwagoner? or because it wasnt done here, ur seen as a trendsetter when u saw it somewhere else?

not trying to hate just showing u the other side of the coin


WOW long post, but i felt it should be said cause u shoudlnt look at ppl liek that, just look at their work and enjoy the variety of cars we do mod and maybe you'll find something cool about other cars like some neat little mod that allows more clearance for wheels or what u did to make a certain wheel fit or sumin?

gotta help each other out, i think car culture in NA has come a long way in starting to show a lot of interesting modified cars
sure theres crap poseing to be a show car or sumin, but take the good with the bad


ill say it again before i get the heat, but id love to see what u do with the 240, as i own one myself and will be picking up a Q45 when i sell my truck, i love VIP and drift, and both have unique styles but share a common ground, low cars, wide wheels, good people. <3 PS excuse my grammer and spelling errors i suck at typing

[uncle_el]

This was a solid 5yrs ago as well, as this was the time i got my 240 as well when SR's werent mainstream, drifting wasnt mainstream, 240s in general were still used by grannys and older people as a source of transpertation. This was even a time when F&F wasnt apart of our pop culture daily dialogue and not even released and the honda scene was at its peak.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0232500/

5 years ago was 2001.* 2001 was when the fast and the furious (f&f) was released... so unless you were being hyperbolic to prove a point (that we should all show love for any and every car), you're incorrect as clearly it was released during* the time in which you state that it was not.

[chmercer]

Van

In their interest, they seem like these bandwagoneers dont think outside the box and break something out of the norm. Its expected for my car to get bashed (not worried since everyone has their own taste) since they are the main stream of this Uber-cool forum just for the super intelligent individuals who eats and sleep drifting. My main concern is, these guys are too good to criticize an unfinished car and put their heart out about thier opinions and when you read it, Their composition/judging is just as good as the smartest kid who graduated from the school for the mentally ill.

The snow plow design with super duper wide wheels with mad crazy offset that needs 2 layers of 50MM over fender on each side with the inexpensive spray paint and who doesnt like to pay top quality work on their 240's are the best from what these guys see and this is the reason why in everything as far as cars there's 2 forms of society, One is bandwagoneers and Trendsetters, Period.


Herb


who cares if people are hating on your car if it is unfinished. big deal. do you not think that the car looks a bit retarded with bone stock everything except wheels and a drop? i mean, come on. nobody is saying "once that car gets aero and clean paint and etc etc its gonna look gross" they are just saying that as it sits, its pretty goofy looking. im sure it will look rockin once its finished. i post as boxy brown on ziptied BTW. i posted the pic of the bn sports car with the MAE styled wheels, to show how much more awesome a car can look if you add aero.

hope that made sense

[battleaxe]

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0232500/

5 years ago was 2001.* 2001 was when the fast and the furious (f&f) was released... so unless you were being hyperbolic to prove a point (that we should all show love for any and every car), you're incorrect as clearly it was released during* the time in which you state that it was not.



i just said it wasnt released as of yet, theres 12 months in a year :buck2:
wow its been THAT long, wow, doenst surprise me i fucked that up hahaha dont watch tv and only watch movies here and there
i was making a basic point that this was before a movie on car tuning was put into mainstream
i got my car in summer 02 and i know these guys had cars before me that were modified and doing the very few drift events that there were
1 every what? couple months?

my point was to love where we've come as a car culture here, as new styles have formulated from what we've seen elsewhere.
i just dont like the word bandwagoner, u could call him a bandwagoner cause he got his 240 now because F&F3 came out now hes labeled as a drifter
and that wouldnt be true, its a 240, and definetly NOT a drifter hahaha

whatever

[shawnthemonster]

im telling ya, two words "super made"

[firelizard]

I dunno, SuperMade is pretty low key. I think (just opinion here) that the car needs something with a bit more bulk to carry the "bigness" that the wheels have to the front and rear.

[NG C-Klasse]

I dunno, SuperMade is pretty low key. I think (just opinion here) that the car needs something with a bit more bulk to carry the "bigness" that the wheels have to the front and rear.

You're on crack. Maybe you're new to Super Made...or should I say Works9:
http://www.works9.com/image/products/s14s15face01.jpg

The "new" Super Made stuff looks like Mode Parfum aero on S chassis cars..the old aero as seen above is made by Works9 and is what most people associate Super Made with...not this:
http://autos.goo.ne.jp/autos/img/special/s/tas2006/data/img_l/turning/i_IMG_0709.jpg

[battleaxe]

i think hes getting the actual supermade aero mike
the s13 model of the s15 one u posted
i was looking for a pic then gave up

from the sounds of it anyways
because the work9 aero i wanted for my s13 is still 'bell bottomed'

[viplife]

Van

In their interest, they seem like these bandwagoneers dont think outside the box and break something out of the norm. Its expected for my car to get bashed (not worried since everyone has their own taste) since they are the main stream of this Uber-cool forum just for the super intelligent individuals who eats and sleep drifting. My main concern is, these guys are too good to criticize an unfinished car and put their heart out about thier opinions and when you read it, Their composition/judging is just as good as the smartest kid who graduated from the school for the mentally ill.

The snow plow design with super duper wide wheels with mad crazy offset that needs 2 layers of 50MM over fender on each side with the inexpensive spray paint and who doesnt like to pay top quality work on their 240's are the best from what these guys see and this is the reason why in everything as far as cars there's 2 forms of society, One is bandwagoneers and Trendsetters, Period.


Herb


you got big balls, and i cannot lie...

[selectivebeef]

you got big balls, and i cannot lie...


i love snow plows

[viplife]

i love snow plows


http://www.angrylife.com/temp/snow_plow.jpg

what a pathetic plow...

[Herb]

Fellow Enthusiasts,

okay first off, whoever is ofended from what i posted above (Its funny because the ex-honda kids came to this discussion again which was never mentioned by me), it was towards to cars that aren't done right. Im too picky when it comes to quality specially when its my vehicle. Maybe the snowplow kit comment was too harsh but im not hating on snowplow kits, ive seen nice one's e.g selectivebeef's, probabbly the nicest in Norcal which i do have respect on the whole car ( which im hoping my car will turn out nice as well). There are tons of 240's on the same "style aero" so like i said from my previous post, i wanted to "break something out of the norm". Im sorry if posted my car too soon with stock everything except suspension and wheels. this is how it sits for now until i gather all my parts.

Ultimately, Im building this car to, again, break something out of the norm and show you guys my pride and joy. I completely see what your guy's opinions about this whole caprice on 24's situation. So what? it doesnt matter to me its all gravy ;D, all you guys know that this is an undergoing project. everyone has +/-feedbacks and i knew before i posted my car that there will be rumors and hating and such. I At least i have the guts to pull something extraordinaire with my crazy camber that i enjoy drving everyday (if you dont like my car keep your bashing to yourself, this is why forum wars start.)Im not here to make feinds or competition.Were all car enthusiasts who enjoys building nice cars in different forms. :)

BTW

Im not a 240 wheel/suspension expert (it was just a drafted write up on the monkey-biz site :uglystupid2:), I hope the person who posted that on Ziptied hears this. :)

Ill keep you folks posted on my project!Have a nice day!

Herb
Herb.Real@gmail.com

[viplife]

Im not a 240 wheel/suspension expert (it was just a drafted write up on the monkey-biz site :uglystupid2:), I hope the person who posted that on Ziptied hears this.* :)


i hear you.* i also never said you were an expert.* however you did manage to say a lot of things about 240 wheel/suspension, i had never heard before.

i had no idea...

in general, Nissan cars are wheel monsters, they dominate the 4x4.5 (4x114.3 category) and the 5x4.5
(5x114.3 catergory).

Their wheel wells and superior wheel clearance under is virtually unbeatable compared to any car maker (Toyota,honda,BMW,Lexus,acura,
etc etc).

any nissan sports car/full sized sedan will take anywheelsize by 9 with a +6 offset (19x9+6) a dash with spice of camber and sweetened*
roll of fender work.

19 inch wheel set-up in a 240 is very hard to find.

VIP style coupe category = in for tons of labor work by relocating the main* vehicle wiring harness on both L&R fenders

Taking off the whole front end takes too many of hours of hard Yelling, cussing ,getting down on* the grease and road kill underpart of the car,

i want to say its around 30pcs of finger cutting 10mm nuts and bolts that i think is very over* engineered in part of nissan just to hold the* whole bumper (SUCK!!)

I chose to screw down the necessary factory bolts ones, it doesnt affect the rigidy of the bumper while driving.

Rear Set-up (I got the vehicle aligned before the installation since the vehicle is already prepped with height to accomodate the 19's)

rear installation, this process takes a good amount of time to determine the wheel clearance between the tire and the fenders.

Since the car was already aligned, we just carefully copied the length of the stock arms and such and from there we started dialing in for more caster and toe controls.

By starting with the 7 degree RUCA that we used, we lowered down the car when it was already rolled, we just had to exercise the smartest guess to make the tires(225/35/19 Falken 451.

VIP Stretch, baller lookin and will get anyones Hot soccer mom's panties!) good looking* by pulling a slight MM clearance on the fenders.

(NOTE NISSAN suspension is known for the diagonal suspension travel, which seen on most nissan's.) (explained with a short clip video here)

[bBOXD]

Herb, Just man up to it. You got over yourself and FUC*** up. And now you just got owned by someone that really knows what thier talking about man. Dont get too big headed. Remember, you didnt really fit those wheels on there. hahahaha. I tried to warn you man. hahaha. Who orginally was going to do this Herb? Oh and where did your rims come from? hahaha. Check yourself bro...

[hahajoey]

wow.. i can't believe he's a trend setter
but yet he didn't even roll his own fenders or do any work..

i just think being cocky and saying you're a trendsetter is kinda big..
especially when obviously theres been cars(EVEN IN CALI) that has
simular fitment...

picture says sept 04(almost 2 years ago)..


BUT i do like this car so called herb has.. i think its sick
how much lip and camber he's running.. but i dont think
he's a trend setter in the least

[NG C-Klasse]

wow.. i can't believe he's a trend setter
but yet he didn't even roll his own fenders or do any work..

How is he a trend setter again? Usually a trend setter puts a trend in motion. What he did has been done before...unless it was sarcasm.

[firelizard]

You're on crack.* Maybe you're new to Super Made...or should I say Works9:

The "new" Super Made stuff looks like Mode Parfum aero on S chassis cars..the old aero as seen above is made by Works9 and is what most people associate Super Made with...not this:
http://autos.goo.ne.jp/autos/img/special/s/tas2006/data/img_l/turning/i_IMG_0709.jpg

Sorry, I am fairly new to the brand, I had never seen Works9 before. When he said Supermade I was thinking the style like the one in the pic above.
That Works9 kit is hot!

[uncle_el]

How is he a trend setter again? Usually a trend setter puts a trend in motion. What he did has been done before...unless it was sarcasm.


definitely sarcasm. we tend to expect that (sarcasm) from hahajoey around here! :D

[hahajoey]

hey hey! i haven't even posted that much lately..
and like i said.. i do like this s13..
i think those wheels are SICK!... they look huge and wide!

[uncle_el]

hey hey! i haven't even posted that much lately..
and like i said.. i do like this s13..
i think those wheels are SICK!... they look huge and wide!


i like the way the car looks, and am looking forward to seeing its progression. add to that, i generally get a kick out of your posts, as you tend to say what needs to be said without any sort of filter.

[Dark Anghell]

This car reminds me of this...
http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/1660/hdgfhfcg1.png

Unless the aero sits extremely low, this car will look like a 4x4 even though it has a nice drop. IMO 18's is the biggest size for S13.

[hahajoey]

theres actually a picture of the car in motion.. and it does look a tad on the big side..
i think 18's would be a better fitment.. and with 18's the car's ground clearance would be
lower too.. i think 18's with the same fitment would be awesome.. but with a kit
maybe he can pull it off.. i have a few s13's on my walls that have 19's and look siiiick

[battleaxe]

Works9:
http://www.works9.com/image/products/s14s15face01.jpg


SuperMade's In house, NOT works9
http://autos.goo.ne.jp/autos/img/special/s/tas2006/data/img_l/turning/i_IMG_0709.jpg


for clarification as it seems theres some confusion
and the SuperMade cars of the past used to run BN Sports for the most part as i know some of you know

[Dark Anghell]

yes and BN-Sports kits are some of the lowest kits available for 240s, and their cars are running either 18" all around or 17/18" combo, with tires tucking...these 19's raise the car too much, so when the kit is on the car, it will sit very high off the ground. He might pull it off, but I think a smaller wheel would look much better.

[jzz30tt]

yes and BN-Sports kits are some of the lowest kits available for 240s, and their cars are running either 18" all around or 17/18" combo, with tires tucking...these 19's raise the car too much, so when the kit is on the car, it will sit very high off the ground. He might pull it off, but I think a smaller wheel would look much better.


I disagree. That's a garsh generalization to make.

If I'm not mistaken that Works9 car is running 20's in the rear? I think so... Even if they are 19's, that car's not too high for your taste is it? Obviously there is some extensive fender work to be done, to run such a wheel. But it can be done and it can be done low.

[NG C-Klasse]

I disagree. That's a garsh generalization to make.

If I'm not mistaken that Works9 car is running 20's in the rear? I think so... Even if they are 19's, that car's not too high for your taste is it? Obviously there is some extensive fender work to be done, to run such a wheel. But it can be done and it can be done low.

18" front, 19" rear...and yes must have wide fenders with stock fenders cut out high. Like I said...it's been done.

[Dominik]

Stock fenders cut higher... I LOVE that look!

[One Ton VIP]

just an fyi, but the 326 guys (who are arguably one of the most influencial groups right now as far as spearheading a new style of appearance for the S-chassis cars in japan that a lot of other manufs are slowly following) are going 20s on S14s and 19s on S13s... and of course they are extraordinarily low.... "inner fender modifications necessary" low

IMO about herb's car: 19s are now PERFECT for the rear of S13s. Like seriously, once you see it in real life, you can not go back. After staring at his car for a while, and going back to selectivebeef's car, we realized that, man, some 19" VSXXs in the back would almost be NEEDED to get the rear looking "right." I mean I've seen 19s on the rear of 2 or 3 other S13s in the US, but they were always quite sunken, or nothing was done to get the flow right from top of wheel/tire into fender, so they never looked all that good. But once you see a set that does flow (albeit with camber, and even if without), you too will realize, geesh, 19s really do fill that rear wheelwell up perfectly. The fronts though.... wow are another story. I'm still thinking 18s are more perfect there. It's a balance thing, and the stagger would complement the shape of the car better... but the shape of the car can be subtly "altered" by careful setting of its stance. And of course there's the added element of the bodykit that could potentially drastically change everything too... it's all a learning curve right now

Hmmm btw, herb, have you taken any new pics of the car at its lower height? I thought that even that made a pretty dang dramatic difference in how it looked... it definitely helped the front out too >HAHA<

as for whatever people say, I love differing opinions, but as I've always said, it's one thing to say you hate something, but be able to articulate why.. cuz it's that ability that then makes for profound discussions and provoke thought.... and it's another to just say "that's stupid" but not even really be able to explain why

btw, moving wheelwell openings upwards/cutting fenders higher = radiusing.

[firelizard]

I think a major part of what makes the wheels look so huge on the car is how much face they have - it's almost solid metal. The Works 9 car has a spacey concave spoked design, which "lightens" the wheel (appearance-wise). These wheels in that size look really bulky, and heavy, unlike the car itself, which has sleek, low profile sports car lines.
It's not so much the wheel dimensions, as it is the low profile car, sitting on visually massive wheels, that makes the wheels look too big for the car imo.
This is why a bodykit adding some bulk to the bottom of the car should restore balance to the car, and it will be quite nice, I think, especially if the kit goes low.

[NG C-Klasse]

Hahahaha...you guys got it all wrong. I said use wide fendres...BUT you have to cut the stock fenders up high and weld the seams to make sure you have the upper clearance to slam the car down with the wider stance. The fenders will look normal from the outside, but the stock cut ones would look retarded without the fenders attached.

[jzz30tt]

Hahahaha...you guys got it all wrong.* I said use wide fendres...BUT you have to cut the stock fenders up high and weld the seams to make sure you have the upper clearance to slam the car down with the wider stance.* The fenders will look normal from the outside, but the stock cut ones would look retarded without the fenders attached.


You can do that... or semi tub the rear inner fenders. S14's are especially a bitch to fit large diameter wheels and have it sit really really low. IIRC one of the Works9 cars is running 20's in the rear of a s14. The car looked amazing becuase it was very slammed.

[Dark Anghell]

exactly! The car needs to be slammed in order to look good. The heights of the 240 in question is way too high. Once the kit is on, it's still going to be too high. This car will need 25mm quarter panels that will enable the car to go another 2" lower. Same goes for the front. The S14 in the picture with popped hood is running 19" 7-series BMW wheels.

[shawnthemonster]

heres a s14 i think it has 20's and look soooo sick. imagine being on the freeway and seeing that rolling by.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v711/shawnthemonster/am_07b.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v711/shawnthemonster/imgout.jpg

[jzz30tt]

exactly! The car needs to be slammed in order to look good. The heights of the 240 in question is way too high. Once the kit is on, it's still going to be too high. This car will need 25mm quarter panels that will enable the car to go another 2" lower. Same goes for the front. The S14 in the picture with popped hood is running 19" 7-series BMW wheels.


HUH? Maybe the front could come down (and aparently has, since the pictures were taken), But, umm the rear of his car is lower than most peoples cars on this forum.

25mm over fenders? What in the hell are you talking about? That has nothing to do with lowering the car. The inner fender is the problem in most cases, not the outter. And s13's have a lot of room in the inner fender. More than other S Chassis'.

[Dark Anghell]

HUH? Maybe the front could come down (and aparently has, since the pictures were taken), But, umm the rear of his car is lower than most peoples cars on this forum.

25mm over fenders? What in the hell are you talking about? That has nothing to do with lowering the car. The inner fender is the problem in most cases, not the outter. And s13's have a lot of room in the inner fender. More than other S Chassis'.


Re-read my post a few times...I never said OVER FENDERS...I said QUARTER PANELS as in add ons that widen the rear of the car, so he can have more space, and so he can lower the car more in the rear. Yes the tires are tucking, but it's a 240, and it still looks like it's a 4x4 because it has so much clearance between the subframe and the ground. The reason why the white 240 posted by Sean looks good is because its slammed to the ground. You just contradicted yourself by saying and I quote " s13's have a lot of room in the inner fender. More than other S Chassis", so he has room to lower it some more, but if he does, the camber needs to be increased OR he can widen the rear of the car to accomodate these wheels.

The car can and will look awesome if it's lower to the ground, and doesn't have 1' gap.

[jzz30tt]

Re-read my post a few times...I never said OVER FENDERS...I said QUARTER PANELS as in add ons that widen the rear of the car, so he can have more space, and so he can lower the car more in the rear. Yes the tires are tucking, but it's a 240, and it still looks like it's a 4x4 because it has so much clearance between the subframe and the ground. The reason why the white 240 posted by Sean looks good is because its slammed to the ground. You just contradicted yourself by saying and I quote " s13's have a lot of room in the inner fender. More than other S Chassis", so he has room to lower it some more, but if he does, the camber needs to be increased OR he can widen the rear of the car to accomodate these wheels.

The car can and will look awesome if it's lower to the ground, and doesn't have 1' gap.


No where did i contradict myself. s13's do have a decent amount of clearence, comparitively speaking. However, he's probably about at the max at that hieght.

I will say it again, modifying the outter fender in this case has nothing to do with lowering the car. The inner fender is the one that needs the work. It's not a hard concept. Why would camber need to be increased? His goal is to fit maximum width/offset of stock fenders. Maybe you missed that?

Why are people with no experience arguing about something like this, acting like they know what they are talking about? Sorry if I offended you, but you sound silly.

[Dark Anghell]

I am not talking about fitting the wheels...obviously they fit. If you look closely at the pictures Herb posted, the rim sticks out further than the body of the car...SO...if he* tried to lower the car some more, the rim would hit the fender-well. That is why I am saying that either doing wider fenders OR adding more camber will allow the car to go lower.

As for me not having any idea what I'm talking about...you don't know my background. For example you didn't know that my best friend drives a heavily modified S13, and I have spent about 6 months under the car helping him out, nor that I spent a few months putting back together a skyline, as well as other projects that I have had a privelage to work on. I am not bragging, and I am not saying that I am an expert...I know faily little compared to some other people. BUT I am saying that I know a thing or two about cars, wheel fitmnet, and most importantly style.

Like I've said about 4 times, this car has a lot of potential, but it will need to be lower to the ground to pull off these wheels and aero.

EDIT: when working on my buddies 240 we had to cut 3-3.5" away from the quarter panel around the wheel-well to ensure there was enough clearance for the wheel travel. So thar car can definately go lower.

[jzz30tt]

I am not talking about fitting the wheels...obviously they fit. If you look closely at the pictures Herb posted, the rim sticks out further than the body of the car...SO...if he* tried to lower the car some more, the rim would hit the fender-well. That is why I am saying that either doing wider fenders OR adding more camber will allow the car to go lower.

As for me not having any idea what I'm talking about...you don't know my background. For example you didn't know that my best friend drives a heavily modified S13, and I have spent about 6 months under the car helping him out, nor that I spent a few months putting back together a skyline, as well as other projects that I have had a privelage to work on. I am not bragging, and I am not saying that I am an expert...I know faily little compared to some other people. BUT I am saying that I know a thing or two about cars, wheel fitmnet, and most importantly style.

Like I've said about 4 times, this car has a lot of potential, but it will need to be lower to the ground to pull off these wheels and aero.


By experience, I meant, fitting extremely agressive wheels on an s13. If you had experience doing this you would understand what I'm talking about. I have no idea what your friends s13 or a skyline have to do with anything? There's a skyline in my driveway, so what?

Why not wait untill the car is complete untill you say it doesn't look right. You think the car will still appear to be so "high" with aero? Personally I think the car is hot as is, and that this guy is running some ballsy ass wheels that a lot of people here would be afriad of. Just getting them to fit on stock fenders is a feat in and of itself.

[Dark Anghell]

Is this agressive enough?
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d3/pavel1983/Nikolays%20car/DSC00042.jpg
Even with aero the 240 is going to sit too high, because hes running 19's. I am not saying that the car is ugly. I give him props for running these wheels and fitting them on a stock body. But I am providing a suggestion...to lower the car more, because otherwise it will sit too high off the ground (even with most agressive aero). BN sports cars are running 17/18 combo on their Type-II aero, which is one of the lowest kits available for that car. So for a car running 19's all around, the front will need to be extremely low, and the rear will have to come down some more as well to achieve the same stance.

So once again the car looks good...but with few adjustments it can look great...that's all I'm saying. I am not bashing this guys car. Nor am I trying to argue with you (jzz30tt, sorry don't know your actual name).

[shawnthemonster]

ok.... back on topic now..

[jzz30tt]

ok.... back on topic now..


lol I have a habit of doing that, and it was loosly on topic... haha.

anyways, the car you posted dark has overfenders, not stock fenders, which is what we are talking about here :)

[Dark Anghell]

lol I have a habit of doing that, and it was loosly on topic... haha.

anyways, the car you posted dark has overfenders, not stock fenders, which is what we are talking about here* :)


Those are not overfenders, they are quarter panels...and that is exactly what I am suggesting...by installing wider quarter panels Herb will be able to go lower.

[viplife]

tub rear of s13...

ive done it, and got lots of room for travel, but without aero my rails touch the ground with just a slight variance in road angle. unrealistic to drive without air or heavy undercarriage modifications.

[viplife]

Is this agressive enough?
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d3/pavel1983/Nikolays%20car/DSC00042.jpg


aggressively stupid, imo.

[firelizard]

Those are not overfenders, they are quarter panels...and that is exactly what I am suggesting...by installing wider quarter panels Herb will be able to go lower.

I call those overfenders, and here's why: they go over the fender. A "quarter panel" implies (to me) a replacement sheetmetal panel, which would involve completely removing the stock quarter panel and welding in the wider one, which is not common on new cars like this, for obvious reasons.

Popular example: http://www.origin-lab.com/overfender.php

The car you posted, does in fact have overfenders, according to my lexicon, and a few others'. I guess overfender and quarterpanel are interchangeable if you want them to be though, they're both pretty accurate.

[One Ton VIP]

- Wow, why is this thread so intense?

- I was talking to a friend about that white S13 earlier, and I said:
Me: i noticed that guy's car is like the jesus to a lot of WA guys
Me: everyone dropping his name and talking about their involvement in it etc
Not saying anyone here is or isn't... but I've just noticed a lot of random people talking about that car like it's their best buddy's on so many different mssg boards. Kinda interesting

- The white car definitely ran into a case of a little too much in the back. Unfortunately the fitment of his rear wheels were even too extreme for most all add-on overfenders (in popular nomenclature, an overfender is a fender panel that consists of material beyond just the actually circular wheelwell/flare area...it doesn't matter exactly how it's attached.. and a flare usually refers to a part that is just the actual flare itself) commonly-avl for the S13. Of course, if his main interest was to truly just run those wheels (i'm sure "performance" wasn't his paramount concern, as if it was, he wouldn't use those wheels), then he could have also tried to add in some more negative camber to get the wheels to look like they should actually fit. Such was the case with herb's car... there is no way to run a 10", +0mm wheel under a 100% stock, unalterered rear S13 fender. And I personally hate the ubiquitous 240SX fender pull (let me insert an image I made from a pic I found on the internet):

http://onetongarage.com/van/waytosalvage.jpg

Ok ok, that's a little extreme, as I don't think anyone in their right mind would/should be pulling their fenders like that anyway (esp. w/o a clear idea of what to do with the pull afterwards), and esp. w/o wheels that need the pull. But point is, ultimately, it's all about the combination of wheel, tire, camber, ride height, fender processing, etc. gelling together to form a single cohesive element that flows in one way or another.

- About ride height, the car is actually quite low... and yup, them big wheels bely that fact. In order to get the car to go even lower, overfenders nor flares are needed. In fact, the beauty of most well-designed independent suspension setups is that they are engineered with a camber curve, that basically cambers the wheel more as the suspension travels/compresses. This is why, if you can set the wheel/tire to clear the fender at static height, in most cases you are good to go at any point. Granted, this is where several other factors come into play in regards to clearances: things such as play and slop in your bushings, tire growth and flex, and body sway. In a perfect world, let's say on a nissan multi-link rear susp, you set your wheel/tire to clear the fender by even just 1mm... then as the suspension compresses over bumps, it will continue to go up, and in even more, and thus, will always clear the fender. However, with softer tires, the sidewall may flex a little, or if your car sways a lot, the body may actually tilt into the tire, or if the bushings are sloppy, the whole wheel/tire assy may shift a few mm in any direction, etc etc. But if you lucky, you can pull it all off. I used to have my Q45 set with just exactly one credit card gap between the tire and rear fender, and it was all good in da hizood. Now... to go even LOWER on an S-chassis, yes some cool cutting will be required inside the fenders. I don't think herb's car will need any of that, as we should be able to get it quite low w/o having to resort to that. But I am anticipating doing some major cutting on my MS13 in order to get it to lay frame, and daily drive at a few inches above ground.. of course this wouldn't be necessary with smaller wheels, but the MS13 looks like it will be inhereting my WEDS which I believe are quite a bit more insane fitment than even that one white 240's wheels, so some pretty intriguing mods will be necessary to get it to all work correctly...

[Dominik]

Can i apply to be one of your long lost relatives? I want to inherit them Rapiers one day!! :D

[aristo93]

Damm thats one sweet 240... ;D

[jzz30tt]

http://onetongarage.com/van/waytosalvage.jpg


What's funnier is him trying to sell that heap for like 13k.... lol

[Dark Anghell]

- Wow, why is this thread so intense?

- I was talking to a friend about that white S13 earlier, and I said:
Me: i noticed that guy's car is like the jesus to a lot of WA guys
Me: everyone dropping his name and talking about their involvement in it etc
Not saying anyone here is or isn't... but I've just noticed a lot of random people talking about that car like it's their best buddy's on so many different mssg boards. Kinda interesting

The wheels have been changed a long time ago...shortly after the photoshoot. This car is built with one purpose...to drift, so performance was the only thing in mind. Just like some members on this board he got the wheels and later realised they were way too agressive. Here are his current wheels:
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d3/pavel1983/Nikolays%20car/DSC00009.jpg
As for people dropping his name...umm I nver said his name, and he is my best buddy ...we've been friends since middle school. The reason why he is like "jesus" is because he is the best drifter in WA and aparently oregon...at the last event he took first place. He also works as an instructor, so many people look up to him because he is the one who got them into drifting, or actually taught them how to get better.

Now my appologies about overfender VS quarter panel confusion.

[battleaxe]

i dunno how any of u lay frame on 240s
my car is lower than most 240s and i have about 2inch from frame to the ground
my exhaust has maybe a finger gap bewteen the ground and metal

unless u have a stock exhaust (still doesnt clear the ground) then iunno how ur doing that
and why would u tub the back of a 240? theres lots of clearance back there
unless ur wanting to run a 14wide wheel with high offset to get flush?
iunno

i think the general repsocne to using overfenders was to take out all that damn camber
i keep forgetting this is a show car site not performance hahaha

yarrrr i want a Q45 for daily

[jzz30tt]

i dunno how any of u lay frame on 240s
my car is lower than most 240s and i have about 2inch from frame to the ground
my exhaust has maybe a finger gap bewteen the ground and metal

unless u have a stock exhaust (still doesnt clear the ground) then iunno how ur doing that
and why would u tub the back of a 240? theres lots of clearance back there
unless ur wanting to run a 14wide wheel with high offset to get flush?
iunno

i think the general repsocne to using overfenders was to take out all that damn camber
i keep forgetting this is a show car site not performance hahaha

yarrrr i want a Q45 for daily


I doubt your car is very low, or you arn't running very big wheels, if you haven't needed to modify the inner fenders.

Show car vs performance has nothing to do with it. There's not a lot a clearence with a 18x10 +10 - -whatever, if your car is even remotely low. And by low, I mean tucking most of the tire on an 18. Anything else isn't low.

[Dark Anghell]

dude why are you bashing other members? Did you not get enough hugs when you were a kid?

[shawnthemonster]

all right guys this thread has gotten a little out of hand for my taste. im locking it. remember to keep the threads on topic to the pic and less bashing/arguing with eachother.